In the book’s introduction, you recall a dream in which you interacted with Norbu about an older student, who had become seriously ill in waking reality. Tell us about the dream, and what happened?
The dream you are referring to was very important for inspiring the first dream yoga book, which is based on the dream yoga and Dzogchen teachings of Chögyal Namkhai Norbu. An elderly woman by the name of Lara had accompanied Chögyal Namkhai Norbu to western Massachusetts where he was conducting a program at the retreat center of a Gurdjieff community. The teacher of this group, Mr. Anderson, had become interested in Dzogchen, and had invited Norbu Rinpoche.
In my dream I was saying to Chögyal Namkhai Norbu that Lara was very ill and that she would soon die. In the dream CNN had responded that he was taking care of her, and that she would be ok. The next morning when I saw him, and before I had a chance to say anything, he said to me that Lara would be fine.
At the least this dream presaged a future event. Even more interesting was my feeling I had that CNN actually knew all about the dream that I’d had before I mentioned anything.
So, from the Dzogchen perspective, an accomplished person could assist in the healing of another while in the dream state? Could a person also get precognitive or clairvoyant information, while dreaming or lucid dreaming? Could initiations occur in the dream state?
As part of the book Dream Yoga and the Practice of Natural Light, I interviewed Norbu Rinpoche regarding possibilities and capacities of accomplished lucid dreamers. In this interview CNN affirmed that a highly developed practitioner might enter the dreams of his or her student, so as to teach and instruct. As I had previously related, his own teacher had entered into his dream and gave the young lama a direct introduction or transmission. CNN at that time was too skeptical to believe that it was actually a real transmission.
In addition to many accounts of healing within dreams in the literature of Tibetan Buddhism, these accounts may be found in many other cultures. For example in my introduction to the original dream yoga book I include examples from Ancient Greece, Native American, and other Shamanic sources related to healing experiences.
Through the dream yoga practice, some accomplished practitioners, like Norbu, receive “mind treasures” and also information on the location of relics. Tell us about that, and how it works, or share an example.
There are innumerable cross-cultural examples of inventors, musicians, shamans, as well as lamas solving problems, receiving healing information, or receiving some sort of important meditation practice in their dreams. As previously mentioned, the extensive introduction I wrote as part of the original dream yoga book includes many cross-cultural examples of these special gifts and often channeled information.
To give a glimpse of how this might occur, a highly developed practitioner might actually make contact with other dimensions of beings. In Chögyal Namkhai Norbu’s case he has had an ongoing relationship with a special other dimensional being called a Dakini. This Dakini, Goma Devi, has channeled important information including meditation practices, meditational dances and healing texts to him for many years.
The Tibetans call these Milam Terma or treasures of the dream. In many cases these special teachings are considered to be highly effective for our present time and circumstances, and enlightened beings had preordained that they should be channeled to our human dimension at a specific time and place.
When reading about Dzogchen views of dream yoga, the topic of death and dying seem central to the practice. Briefly, how does death and dying connect with dream yoga?
Sleeping, dreaming and awakening mirror the experiences of birth and death and the transition to another life. There is a French expression, “la petite mort,” which compares sleep to a little death. The possibility of reincarnation has increasingly become more accepted even in the West. Simply put, the possibility of developing lucidity and even special awareness within sleep and dreams is practice for maintaining awareness through the transition from this life into our next reincarnation.
More elaborate explanations may be found in both the original dream yoga book and my new book, The Royal Road to Enlightenment. I would also recommend Mind Beyond Death by Dzogchen Ponlop as well as The Book of Living and Dying by Tsogyal Rinpoche.
When you hear stories of people who have Near Death Experiences, you sometimes see comments about “the light.” So in that moment, how should they respond to the light?
As we transition from this life into another life we have many experiences. According to the Tibetan Buddhist explanations, shortly after death we will enter into a deep unconsciousness and then after some period of time, usually three or four days, we will emerge from that deep unconsciousness. At that moment, the mind is reawakening even though the body is a corpse. I repeat; the mind reawakens at this point! Of course this viewpoint is not universally accepted here in the West, particularly in the medical community.
Although the mind is reawakening, there is a short period before the mind which intellectualizes and judges experience kicks in. At this point in the transition through the bardo of dharmata one will experience a ‘clear light’ experience which, in actuality, is the unfettered and unfiltered arising of our actual true nature. These moments are considered to afford a special opportunity for the practitioner who has developed true Awareness, and the practitioner is taught to integrate with the experience rather than react in some other way, such as ignoring or fleeing.
Although everyone will experience this arising of our own true nature at this juncture, most of us will not be Aware, and it will pass in a fleeting moment. The Dzogchen practice of natural light is practice for being able to integrate with this experience It is important to note that the Awareness I am referring to is not synonymous with lucidity. Lucidity is considered to be a type of mindfulness whereas true Awareness is beyond relative mind.
In the book, Norbu comments, “Many of the methods of practicing Dharma that are learned during waking can, upon development of dream awareness, be applied in the dream condition. In fact, one may develop these practices more easily and speedily within the dream if one has the capacity to be lucid. There are even some books that say that if a person applies a practice within a dream, the practice is nine times more effective than when it is applied during the waking hours.”
Why do you feel a practice done in a lucid dream may have greater effectiveness than one done in waking hours?
The dream body and, indeed, the body which arises in the transition from our life into another life is called the ‘mental body.’ It is obvious that when we dream, it is not our actual physical body which is having the experiences and adventures associated with dream life. The senses are dormant and, consequently, all experiences are arising from the mind.
When experiences are filtered through the senses and the judgmental mind, the power and efficacy of the experience, and our capacity to effect change within that experience is vastly diminished. Conversely, when we are able to apply meditational practices or attempt to solve problems in the lucid dream, the full power of the mind may be brought to bear without filters.
At these times the mind is considered to be seven to nine times more powerful than during waking consciousness. This can help explain the extraordinary stories of healing and problem solving that are common in our literature. It is also why Norbu Rinpoche states that meditation practice in the dream state is far more effective than during the day. This is not to say that it is easy. One of my teachers once remarked that ‘awareness is easy to pick up but difficult to carry.’
In the book, Norbu discusses a dream yoga technique to achieve lucidity, saying as you fall asleep. “Then concentrate on a white Tibetan syllable A at the center of your body. If you prefer an English A it is acceptable. The important thing is that it corresponds in your mind to the sound Ahhh. It is important that when you see that letter you automatically know what its sound is.”
So why is the Tibetan syllable A important? And what is the significance of seeing it as white? Finally, what has been students’ experience with this technique?
The technique which you are referring to, visualizing a luminous white A in the heart as you go to sleep, is actually more associated with the practice of natural light related to Dzogchen. The A is used with its corresponding sound, because this corresponds to the original sound from which all form ultimately arises.
In CNN’s explanation of this technique he explains the visualization and then encourages his students to relax completely into sleep. In this case, relaxing completely into sleep means finding one’s natural state or Awareness with a capital A. In order to find one’s natural state we must first have some direct introduction, also called pointing out instructions, from a qualified teacher.
After hearing CNN speak or after reading the original book, some may have attempted to apply this technique in order to increase lucidity in dreams. Per se this visualization is not really a technique for developing lucidity, but more for entering into the natural state of Awareness. If one succeeds in maintaining transcendent awareness within the states of sleep and dream, then lucidity and other meditational experiences may arise as a by-product of this awareness.
Besides editing Norbu’s book, you have also written a book of your own. Tell us about that.
In my more recent book, The Royal Road to Enlightenment, I have drawn upon my experience both as a psychologist and as a long time practitioner of Buddhist meditation. For example, as part of my explorations in transpersonal psychology I have studied hypnosis, as well as psychodrama, as well as more traditional methods of dream interpretation.
As a long time practitioner of Buddhism and a certified meditation instructor within the Dzogchen Community founded by Chögyal Namkhai Norbu, I am also well-versed in the benefits of developing a meditative practice both for day as well as night.
I have found hypnotic induction to be a highly effective means of inducing lucid dreams, and extraordinary transpersonal meditative experiences. When I first began to use induction as part of my workshops more than twenty years ago I didn’t know how I would integrate the entire group into one person’s exceptional dream experience. I discovered that psychodrama of lucid dreams is a truly extraordinary means to effect this integration. When the psychodrama goes well it can feel as if we are all experiencing the dream for the first time.
A Native American medicine man once stated that until a dream is acted on the earth the power of the dream is not released. After many years of doing psychodrama of extraordinary lucid dreams and meditational-type experiences, I have come to believe that these types of psychodramas were the basis for the Greek mystery theater. It is likely that the priests had a repertoire of initiatory type dreams, which were re-enacted again and again to deepen the participant’s wisdom.
My workshops maintain the spirit of Tibetan Buddhism very closely. Participants who have completed my workshops generally have an enhanced appreciation that life is very much like a dream and all material things are impermanent. Some, but not all, of the techniques I utilize, like zhiné meditation, are traditional, but other techniques are related to my experience as a psychologist. Regardless of which hat I am wearing, that of a psychologist or that of a meditation teacher, I consider a reduction of attachment to be a valuable goal of my workshop.
I also wrote a novel called The White Dolphin. The heroine of this book is an environmental activist who is proficient in lucid dreaming. In this book she makes contact with an extraordinary white dolphin through lucid dreaming.
The novel is fictional, however, an experienced lucid dreamer may make contact with other dimensions of beings. Although fictional, coincidently as I have gone around teaching my courses several people have come to me and said that they also have dreams of a white dolphin. So you never know.
The novel has been highly reviewed. It is fast-paced with a romantic edge and serves to raise consciousness on the destruction of our environment. Both of my two recent books are easily available through Kindle as well as on Amazon.
If people want to learn more about your workshops and classes, where should they look? Any final advice for lucid dreamers, as they go more deeply into lucid dreaming?
I have traveled to something like thirty countries over more than two decades teaching meditation and dream yoga. Frequently, but not always, my workshops are organized by members of the international Dzogchen community. To keep in touch and to publicize my programs I maintain a page called Tibetan Dream Yoga on Facebook which people can join, or we can possibly meet through a lucid dream.
Thanks!
